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World news and politics.

tsf said:
I wasn't 'going on' about freedoms'.

I just made a point that people may think they're free but they're not under the US system

As someone who has seen both world's I feel justified to comment.

It's just a different form of oppression.
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So your friend's dad was referring The US, was he? Undoubtedly The US has a lot of issues but there is no way even 5% would prefer to go to the shackles of communist or socialist rule. People who've fled those places warn about it to those activists who want it.

Of course, a balance of sorts in the middle and looking after people is the right way to go. The United States has so much work to do there. There are plenty of people who've moved to the country and been successful in their own right as well.
 
zimbos05 said:
So many people love talking about freedom and what it means, and how the people deserve it, yet have never lived under a dictator or a system that oppresses. So when they are actually, they don't see it.
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People can see it right now with some of these new protest and speech laws.

I think people in the west may really struggle to escape in a financial sense if they wanted to pack up and move away. I think there we have a certain level of rigidness.

The day we're unable assemble freely within reason, depart a state, potentially not obtain travel documents and know people have gone missing to the killing fields is when the writing will be on the wall.
 
JS96 said:
People can see it right now with some of these new protest and speech laws.

I think people in the west may really struggle to escape in a financial sense if they wanted to pack up and move away. I think there we have a certain level of rigidness.
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Whilst I agree with you on the new protest laws, it's laughable that you think we live in a dictatorship. That shit the right -especially the media- pulled with Dan Andrews, shocking.

The day we're unable assemble freely within reason, depart a state, potentially not obtain travel documents and know people have gone missing to the killing fields is when the writing will be on the wall.
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Almost like you're describing something I can't quite put a name to. I think it's called something like rice, or mice....something like that.
 
zimbos05 said:
Clearly your readings differ to mine.



Anyway, has been pointed out multiple times. One can oppose Maduro, and also be against what the US has done. It's clearly all politics and Trump has broken multiple international laws. UN wont do anything because the US are a big major power in the UN and -much like Israel- do not care for international law and will just do as they please.

The right have longed spoken about dictators, well, you finally get to have another one of your own.

Anyway, this has been a...somewhat fun conversation, that is quite clear you are staunch on and see no issue with anything The Orange one does, so enjoy that.
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Glad that's been cleared up so the statement ring truer. From what I've read they were mainstream reports that didn't have a tinge of bias. They've conveniently left things out.

Searching the above information leads me to a website called the Cradle so I think I'll use this to cross reference things but a quick search on its own credibility does cast doubt as well.
 
zimbos05 said:
Whilst I agree with you on the new protest laws, it's laughable that you think we live in a dictatorship. That shit the right -especially the media- pulled with Dan Andrews, shocking.



Almost like you're describing something I can't quite put a name to. I think it's called something like rice, or mice....something like that.
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I think you're misreading what I've posted. These new laws are hardly anything close to a dictatorship.
 
zimbos05 said:
That's not what the people of New York seem to have said.

Tell that to Scandinavia (i'm talking about Socialism)
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I highly doubt Mamdani is going to implement Cambodia or Cuba style policies. His challenge is more an economic and social one rather than political.

The Scandinavian model is not the one I'm referring too. They have free elections and an economic system that works. I'm referring to the starving hoardes of Eastern Europe and the murderous groups of Asia and South America.

Anyway we'll leave it at that.
 
JS96 said:
I think you're misreading what I've posted. These new laws are hardly anything close to a dictatorship.
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Wait, so you support the new protest laws? It's not dictatorship, but it definitely its suppression of freedom of speech and right to protest.

JS96 said:
I highly doubt Mamdani is going to implement Cambodia or Cuba style policies. His challenge is more an economic and social one rather than political.

The Scandinavian model is not the one I'm referring too. They have free elections and an economic system that works. I'm referring to the starving hoardes of Eastern Europe and the murderous groups of Asia and South America.

Anyway we'll leave it at that.
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That's the thing though. If people are going to talk about things, they need to be balanced, not pick and choose. I may be wrong, but I get the feeling you are capitalist? I think we can both agree that some places have poorly implemented socialism and it has not worked, much like how capitalism is now not working. However here are also other that have implemented socialism in aspects of society that have worked tremendously well, and it's not fair that socialism gets labelled only as bad, and that we have leaders and media who misrepresent ideologies.

Yeah, I think I need a break from the world. It's gotten too depressing.
 
zimbos05 said:
Wait, so you support the new protest laws? It's not dictatorship, but it definitely its suppression of freedom of speech and right to protest.


That's the thing though. If people are going to talk about things, they need to be balanced, not pick and choose. I may be wrong, but I get the feeling you are capitalist? I think we can both agree that some places have poorly implemented socialism and it has not worked, much like how capitalism is now not working. However here are also other that have implemented socialism in aspects of society that have worked tremendously well, and it's not fair that socialism gets labelled only as bad, and that we have leaders and media who misrepresent ideologies.

Yeah, I think I need a break from the world. It's gotten too depressing.
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Final comment. All I said was that the new protest laws are something that people in Australia would notice as an encroachment on rights which then is an indicator that things are going in a certain direction but this is absolutely nowhere near the dictatorship levels of other states.

For the chuckling record, I know I'm a broken record here, I scored more left than Muz on the ABC barometer. Must have been the questions on the PBS or something :D.

Absolutely this modern day rabid capitalism is rotten. I believe in free enterprise as it should foster innovation and all those curves you see need to be as optimal as possible. The current state in many areas is oligopoly style. The world has changed and I miss the self sustaining thing that every area had services run by a local where the goal wasn't mass profit. The pub landlord, postmaster, baker lived on the property upstairs. The 90's were sweet as we till had these and the private chains so we were spoiled for choice and had price pressure. Unfortunately and obviously the small ones failed and here we are today. I try to avoid chains where possible and actually loathe a few who won't see a cent from me.

At the same time I can't agree with too much government control or a rogue welfare state. Welfare is indeed vital for those in need but the German version of it has become a free ticket for many able people. I don't think it helps the right people when needed. As a sole trader during covid, the German state said to maintain my status, I'm worth 80€ a month to them and I'll have to use my own money for living expenses. Others too lazy to work could simply sign on, have rent, energy paid and transport subsidized and get 500€ cash a month for month. Most bakers, hairdressers and retail workers only earn about 200€ more a month after expenses for 160 hours plus a month.
 
zimbos05 said:
If you're going to be disingenuous, then there is not point in having a conversation with you.

"if anyone killed a person… it would be as if he killed all mankind; and if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of all mankind"
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Sure, but I am on record as saying that ANY life taken in the service of ANY god is a sin... can you say the same?
 
Muz said:
Yeah bang on. It's impossible to defend the US and yet there are people here saying they had no choice.

But then again there are people that think levelling a country and killing 65000 people is just fine and dandy because, you know, they're brown and the wrong religion.
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tsf said:
anyone who supports the US in their actions here cannot sook if the Chinese come for our resources, all fair game now.
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Not sure if any of this is directed at me, just want it known that I DO NOT in any way agree with what the US is doing, just wanting to point out that, at least for once, its NOT justb a delusional Trump move... it has been on the cards for a while.
 
tsf said:
So why does he also need to attack Colombia? Mexico? Greenland ?

All ones he's threatening.

Are we headed for the first world cup where a co-host is bombing the other co-host....because tantrum boy cant handle his little ego. He doesn't like the Colombian president because he stands up to him.

Also what happened to all these 'Trump is the president of peace, no war blah blah' that were here,

Also, if a right wing puppet is put in, we know how that story finishes in latin america. Expect 100s of thousands more refuges trying to get to the states.
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Colombia is for spite and Mexico is just bullshit posturing As for Denmark, its a bluster (Jesus I hope it is) otherwise we are really fucked.
 
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zimbos05 said:
This is the funny part. I know some people who was like, "the Venezuelans want this". Then I speak to South Americans, including Venezuelans and they are like, "we don't want this Trump dude"
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It is an often forgotten fact that rarely does 100% of the population agree on any thing at any given time.. There is a reason why civil war is the MOST destructive...
 
JS96 said:
Absolutely ludicrous. This has all only been happening for 70 years where international law is ignored by so many countries and now this is suddenly the catalyst? Illegality has been the norm for decades. Act first, worry about legal side later.

Australia isn't some misbehaving rogue in the region. The United States is not the only country pissed at Venezuela. The Caribbean are tired of being drug stopovers. Guyana has had its territory infringed. Colombia is sick of border skirmishes. I think it was Peru, Chile and Argentina also welcomed the move.

Plenty of other leaders have been found out for calling for Maduro's removal years before and now condemning it. Sure the ends don't justify the means but it can't be denied that this hasn't been called for by a vast range of people and the United States wanted and possibly had to make a world energy chess move.
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It was as illegal and abhorrent then as it is now... Hague is only for the weaker nations....
 
JS96 said:
Some Venezuelans abroad were asked about oil and they said they really couldn't care at this rate as any kind of reset is better than what's been going on. They're abroad so obviously they're less affected.
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In the same way the Greeks of the 50s and early 60s who migrated to the US, Canada and Australia didnt have much to say about the CIA's Junta part from delaying their triumphant holidays back to the motherland till after 1974...
 
JS96 said:
Yes Maduro's removal has been called for. Would it have happened internally? Very unlikely. There are stories circulating that the Venezuelan officials arranged or agreed to this incursion. I have no idea whether that's plausible but the fact he and his wife were so easily extracted is surprising not to mention his taunting the US should come.

I'm referring to the fact the since the UN was formed the same illegal acts have happened numerous times around the world and they've hardly done anything to stop it. They read their charter messages, maybe some big countries threaten little ones but they're all busy killing amongst themselves too.

Just last week it was announced across the markets that US gas prices were down by 17%. Driving has become a bit more affordable again.

The most recent developments are that the United States doesn't want adversaries drawing oil from Venezuela. They've stated they have enough of their own too. This is a external policy chess move that would've been inevitable.

From my reading the claim that the United States stole Iraqi oil isn't substantiated. I'm surprised as that statement has rung around a lot. It looks like French and Chinese companies got a lot of contracts and yes, some American ones too, but also post war the oil was controlled by the new Iraqi government.
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Trumps removal has ALSO been called for... shit even Albo's removal has been called for mate....

Putin has been threatened by old Trumpie himself but that's one bridge he trembles to step on.....

Bullies will ALWAYS be bullies until somebody smacks them in the chops and tells them to fuck off...:)

Strong always fucks weak ... if it stands unopposed. It has been going on since antiquity, doesn't mean it is morally justifiable.
 
Monoethnic Social Club said:
Sure, but I am on record as saying that ANY life taken in the service of ANY god is a sin... can you say the same?
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You realise that quote is direct from the quran. Therefore, Islamically, taking any life is not just a sin, but is against the word and will of god. Therefore, not just a sin, but an affront to him.

Also, Muslims have been on record saying the same for decades. Written op ed's saying it, been on tv saying it, shouted it through social media, mentioned it in lectures... everyone just chooses to ignore it and keeps going, "dO yOU ConDEmN?!" "wHy DoNT yOU CaLL iT OuT?"
 
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