Bulldogs Debate Page

[Marki]

I don’t think we win today no matter what changes we make. We don’t have the team yet. But we have a coach that gets more out of the players we have than any other coach could.

You are right in that we dont win this game with any other players in our current squad.

But we don't win it with 5 Payne Hass's either.

Our defence let us down badly. Our slide and scramble defence was non existent.

 

[Marki]

Yes that is how I see it.
Sexton and Burton seemed ok in defence against the Storm.
If they were fit, Critter and Montoya would have made a difference, especially both. We probably still loose, but it looks better.

I hope Cirro takes the time to review things in the off season. In these big games we lose the ruck and the play the ball speed is a mismatch. Better middles winning some of the collisions will help.

I think that there may be times when a big guy like Hughes is good option.

In addition to better middles we need a better halfback and fullback. Woods is the likely halfback, the only question is when. For fullback there are multiple options.

So 2026 should be better than 2025, hopefully we can take the next step. The only danger is players being deflated by this season. That is why Cirro talked up the second half effort.

It is important for the coach and players to stay focused and positive and for fans to stay patient and positive.

Theres no guarantee '26 is better than '25.

We still havent settled on a dependable spine.

Galvin and Woods will eventually be the 6 and 7 but FB and Hooker are up in the air.

Hope we nail a gun FB soon as its the single most important position in the modern game.

 

[Hounddog]

Theres no guarantee '26 is better than '25.

We still havent settled on a dependable spine.

Galvin and Woods will eventually be the 6 and 7 but FB and Hooker are up in the air.

Hope we nail a gun FB soon as its the single most important position in the modern game.

Marki i think that our fullback options are so good for 2026 that we might be moving 2 good young fullbacks on, Cochrane and Fing.

The half O'Neill may also be leaving.

In recent times I regret that Averillo and Papalli have left. Like them I expect O'Neill and Cochrane to play NRL for another club.

Seems like our fullback options for 2026 in order might be:-
Crichton, Dykes, Tracey, Fitzgibbon, Udeah?

I don’t know much about Udeah, I don't even know how to spell his name, but he can play wing, centre and fullback. Actually the name might be wrong young player mixed up with import from Broncos.

The young FB school boy star Bryenton really looks like Benji Marshall when he runs the ball, i never seen a player dominate a game with 2 strong teams, like he did.

I don’t know how we are going to fit everyone in, or where they all will play.

Burton apparently busted his shoulder at training Thursday night before the Panthers game, thst sums up the luck we had in preparation for the game.

Long term, Woods is a proper 7 and Galvin is a proper 6.

One of the good young halves is Barakat, a few years away from NRL, but seem to have everything it would take to be an NRL player.

We have some other good halves in the lower grades and attracting good young players to the club doesn't seem to be a problem.

I think Burton will play centre, but may revert to 6 if we need him there.

In 2 years time we might have gun players in every spine position.

 

[Hounddog]

Actually I don't know much about Fitzgibbon, but he is the son of the Sharks coach.

I don’t know how solid these rumours are, but multiple sources seem to mention the same players.

We will need to wait for the top 30, because there might be a few surprises.

I am wondering how long Burton will be at the club and with the new Perth team joining the comp he might not be the last big name player to leave.

I think that the plan is to have a young spine and coach them to play the way that we want.

Fullback is tricky due to so many apparent contenders. But in the long run, Bryenton might be just too good. He certainly has a lot of X-Factor in attack.

It will mostly be developing young players in the lower grades and signing young guys close to ready for NRL from now on. We might go for a few quality experienced forwards if they become available.

Overall we are adding talent and attacking ability. Defence, experience, composure and execution might take a few temporary steps backwards or sideways.

In 2026 we should have enough experienced players and enough depth to help the young guys out.

 

[Hounddog]

For context when the opposition is winning the contact in the middle, getting fast play the balls and leaving defenders on the ground behind the ruck, it is hard for any defensive system to handle.

The problem occurs on the edge because players jamb in.

Stopping the dominance in the middle is easier than handling it.

 

[Hounddog]

Panthers favourites against the Broncos.

I have the match as Broncos 52% Panthers 48%.

Not much difference between the sides and the home crowd is the majority of that 4 %.

Where the Dogs were at and just the way that the match up panned out made the Panthers look a bit better than they were.

While we didn't give the Panthers a hard work out, the week of and a familiar home ground also move the needle.

Madge is smart enough to know that the Broncos need to win the collisions in the middle to win the game and Walsh is plan B.

While they don't have Carrigian, the Broncos pack is far stronger than the Dogs pack.

Broncos edge defence is more settled.

The only player on the field as good as Walsh is Walsh. Staggs and Mam are also dangerous.

Panthers didn't beat us with individual brilliance, one moment of individual brilliance can fire up the crowd.

Panthers will probably try to win with defence and shutting down Walsh. That is what we would have attempted to do.

If the Broncos genie escapes from the bottle and the crowd get excited, the Panthers will not be able to get it back in the bottle.

Or perhaps the Panthers find another gear, the game against us wasn't a good yardstick.

 

[Hounddog]

With the players joining the club, some of the may be too young to play NRL in 2026,
Thompson, and CCT have already played NRL, Dykes may have played a few games but is definitely old enough.
My hunch is that Hopoi and Todd are ready for more NRL. Latu close to ready.
Spinks, Young, Alatini might be promoted from development squad to NRL.
Tia, Jones and perhaps some of the new signings development squad.
Our NSW cup squad last year was padded out with a few below average journeyman players.
I'll be looking at top 30, development squad, NSW cup squad and even Flegg to get the full picture. Some of the new players may land anywhere between top 30 and Flegg.

Bryenton may start out in Harold Matt's, but he could play some Ball or Flegg. Reserve grade fullback will be interesting, not sure who that will be.

 

[Zoz2025]

With the players joining the club, some of the may be too young to play NRL in 2026,
Thompson, and CCT have already played NRL, Dykes may have played a few games but is definitely old enough.
My hunch is that Hopoi and Todd are ready for more NRL. Latu close to ready.
Spinks, Young, Alatini might be promoted from development squad to NRL.
Tia, Jones and perhaps some of the new signings development squad.
Our NSW cup squad last year was padded out with a few below average journeyman players.
I'll be looking at top 30, development squad, NSW cup squad and even Flegg to get the full picture. Some of the new players may land anywhere between top 30 and Flegg.

Bryenton may start out in Harold Matt's, but he could play some Ball or Flegg. Reserve grade fullback will be interesting, not sure who that will be.

At the end of the day the team definitely over achieved this year . No one had us in the the top 4 . I think Gould knew we could not win this years comp regardless who was in the team and probably wanted Galvin to get finals experience up his sleeve . That's the vibe I got with his explanation of things .. I think the window of us winning a comp with the current crop of players may have closed and Cirro and Gus are getting the team prepared for the next phase . I can see a couple of big name players leaving soon for bigger cheques the club doe not want to go down the path
Of losing young talent because of it ..
I hate to bring it up so many years after but the ghost of letting Thurston go probably still haunts the club to this day ... But I see good times ahead ..

 

[Hounddog]

At the end of the day the team definitely over achieved this year . No one had us in the the top 4 . I think Gould knew we could not win this years comp regardless who was in the team and probably wanted Galvin to get finals experience up his sleeve . That's the vibe I got with his explanation of things .. I think the window of us winning a comp with the current crop of players may have closed and Cirro and Gus are getting the team prepared for the next phase . I can see a couple of big name players leaving soon for bigger cheques the club doe not want to go down the path
Of losing young talent because of it ..
I hate to bring it up so many years after but the ghost of letting Thurston go probably still haunts the club to this day ... But I see good times ahead ..

Thurston leaving is the thing I hate the most, particularly the thought that we might have given Anasta priority over him.

I think that the core of this team will be around next season a lot of our players are young enough.

IMO Hayward, Woods and Gavin are 3 parts of a spine, we need a fullback and a lock or Galvin might eventually be the lock.

We need more size and quality in the side to to win a comp.

If Hayward is the starting hooker and CCT and Young are the bench options i am keen to see how that goes. When we last played Manly CCT was good for them.

Dykes is a gamble due to injury issues and we may have only signed him to a one year contract. There is no doubt that injury free he would be a great NRL fullback.

If Dykes doesn't work out we have some good young players 1-2 years away.

These days you need quality in at least 15 out of 17 positions. IMO of we factor in injuries we only had quality in around 10 positions against the Panthers and we were a long way short in the spine, at prop and at lock.

We just didn't have the players, but with a bit of luck we could have beaten Melbourne. We might have what we need to go a step further next season.

The amount of change we are seeing is an indication of what Gus and Cirro think is required.

 

[Hounddog]

When the stats and your eyes are telling you the same thing, you don't need a 3rd opinion.

Burto's playmaking stats are worse than Sexton's, which are a lot worse than Galvin's.

Burto might start the season at 5/8, with Woods coming off the bench. But Woods at left-hand playmaker at some stage seems very likely.

With IMO big issues in the halves, at prop and at lock, it isn't surprising that our attack was below par. Hooker and fullback were also barely a pass mark.

Burto's best chance of playing SOO is coming off the bench to cover centre, 5/8 and lock. Playing some centre and lock for us will help his chances.

We can't judge Kiks on late season form when he was probably carrying more than one injury. Let's see how he goes playing outside of Woods.

Spinks is the other likely candidate for left side backrower.

I would like to see Kika starting at lock and Burton playing lock off the bench. Even if we only try it once, that will answer the question.

I'm not sold on Salmon/Mann, I think Mann is a real mixed bag passing the ball. He is a far better defender than Burton, but perhaps we are going to weaken the defence to improve the attack.

 

[Hounddog]

Broncos nearly made me look like a bad judge.

They need to run hard in the forwards early rather than passing wide,

 

[Zoz2025]

Thank God Panthers gone never thought I would cheer the Broncos to win ..
I like Madge as a coach. He's tough on his players but wants to get the best out of them. I think Souths and Tigers players were just a bunch of sooks and they couldn't handle his coaching method.
He even got NSW over the line to. I have respect for Reynolds still giving his best after all these years . Rabbits should kept him rather than Mitchell....

 

[Hounddog]

I just didn't want another Panthers/Storm GF.

Once it got down to the final 4 I didn't want any of them to win.

IMO Broncos were sloppy and forced a few dumb plays at the start of the match.

Storm v Sharks was probably a higher standard game.

Broncos have the most talent, and they are fit, but they make a lot of dumb mistakes.

I don’t think that we are that far off matching the better sides. It will be a big ask for Woods to be great in his first year of NRL, but that is probably what it will take.

 

[Hounddog]

Overall, I think that the Sharks are the slightly unlucky side, they ran into a better version of the Storm than we played.

If we were able to scrape a win over the Storm, the Sharks probably beat us.

On the recent form, Sharks probably beat the Broncos.

But the Broncos winning the GF wouldn’t be a surprise.They can play better, and Carrigian will make a difference.

I view the season as us finishing 5th or 6th, we will not be 4th until we win at least one semi.

 

[Hounddog]

Cirro said a few interesting things when interviewed by Kenty.

We can't expect to win in 26, 27, 28 by copying what Penrith has done in the previous 5 seasons.

It is getting harder to win with defence.

Attack is trending from structured to unstructured.

I agree with Cirro and it means more entertaining, attack focus footy, massive momentum shifts etc.

It means all key spine positions, half, 5/8, lock, hooker and fullback need to be instinctive eyes up footy players.

Cirro also said that Galvin didn't need much coaching on attack, his instincts are good.

Cirro also more or less confirmed that lock plays a bit like a traditional halfback in our team.

Overall I think that we are on the right track and the Dogs should evolve into an entertaining attacking side.

 

[Marki]

Cirro said a few interesting things when interviewed by Kenty.

We can't expect to win in 26, 27, 28 by copying what Penrith has done in the previous 5 seasons.

It is getting harder to win with defence.

Attack is trending from structured to unstructured.

I agree with Cirro and it means more entertaining, attack focus footy, massive momentum shifts etc.

It means all key spine positions, half, 5/8, lock, hooker and fullback need to be instinctive eyes up footy players.

Cirro also said that Galvin didn't need much coaching on attack, his instincts are good.

Cirro also more or less confirmed that lock plays a bit like a traditional halfback in our team.

Overall I think that we are on the right track and the Dogs should evolve into an entertaining attacking side.

I agree with Ciro's thoughts, but i think he's afew years too late.

In any case, it means he will look to overhaul our entire spine and that is possibly why Mahoney was let go and Burton will be moved on.

Cant have structured and 1 dimensional players in your team when you strive to be a contender.

You need absolute X-factor in your FB and at least 1 of your halves. Errors are part of the way they play. You just need to defend them but reap the rewards of their flash plays.

Its been the blueprint for the modern game for over 20 years. I dont know why Ciro has only just thought of it now.

 

[Hounddog]

I agree with Ciro's thoughts, but i think he's afew years too late.

In any case, it means he will look to overhaul our entire spine and that is possibly why Mahoney was let go and Burton will be moved on.

Cant have structured and 1 dimensional players in your team when you strive to be a contender.

You need absolute X-factor in your FB and at least 1 of your halves. Errors are part of the way they play. You just need to defend them but reap the rewards of their flash plays.

Its been the blueprint for the modern game for over 20 years. I dont know why Ciro has only just thought of it now.

FB is now the biggest question mark, but we are trying.

I see Woods and Burton as competing for left side half.

Spinks and Kiks potentially competing for left side backrow.

Critter, Tracey and hopefully Dykes competing for fullback this year and Fitzgibbon, Bryenton and perhaps a few others competing in future years.

I now think Cirro just creates multiple options and then goes with the one that works best. Over time ime players tend to get replaced by better options.

I think that the intention was to improve the attack this season.

The attack looked best with Hayward at lock, but with Marhoney going, we needed to move Hayward to hooker.

Lock and FB are the biggest opportunities to improve our attack, we need to improve both positions.

I'm in the minority, but I want to see what Kiks can do starting at lock, completely different proposition to Salmon and similar enough in defence.

Initially I think Cirro and Gus just wanted to create a team that could compete and win some games. Also a team strong enough to attract good players and able to support young players and transition them to NRL in the right way.

Some of the players that helped turn the ship around might not be good enough to take the next step, or might get a better deal elsewhere.

We can't compromise on quality in any position and especially not in key spine positions.

Good enough to win a comp is only good enough when that player is part of the reason why we will win.

 

[Marki]

S

FB is now the biggest question mark, but we are trying.

I see Woods and Burton as competing for left side half.

Spinks and Kiks potentially competing for left side backrow.

Critter, Tracey and hopefully Dykes competing for fullback this year and Fitzgibbon, Bryenton and perhaps a few others competing in future years.

I now think Cirro just creates multiple options and then goes with the one that works best. Over time ime players tend to get replaced by better options.

I think that the intention was to improve the attack this season.

The attack looked best with Hayward at lock, but with Marhoney going, we needed to move Hayward to hooker.

Lock and FB are the biggest opportunities to improve our attack, we need to improve both positions.

I'm in the minority, but I want to see what Kiks can do starting at lock, completely different proposition to Salmon and similar enough in defence.

Initially I think Cirro and Gus just wanted to create a team that could compete and win some games. Also a team strong enough to attract good players and able to support young players and transition them to NRL in the right way.

Some of the players that helped turn the ship around might not be good enough to take the next step, or might get a better deal elsewhere.

We can't compromise on quality in any position and especially not in key spine positions.

Good enough to win a comp is only good enough when that player is part of the reason why we will win.

Stability in the spine is paramount.
We shouldn't be in this position where we are a top 8 team but still trying to figure out our spine.

I feel 2026 could be abit of a backward step in this regard as we have to sort out the hooker position as well as figure out how and when we bring Woods in and how we shuffle out Burton.

The club made a decision 5years ago to put all its eggs in the Burton basket. It ran its course and ultimately proven to be wrong. Penrith realised it in 2021 and moved him out of the halves in favour of Luai, but made him the focal point.

We will probably settle for Galvin-Woods as halves by the end of the year, but still need to resolve our FB and Hooker going forward.

If we dont fix these quickly, our window will close and we'll be back rebuilding our back-rowers again...

 

[Hounddog]

Hayward will be a good hooker.

In the past we had to sign who we could get, and rules have changed over the last couple of years.

Burton's kicking game was essential when we struggled to make yards including this season.

He can still kick from centre or lock.

I think Preston / Spinks are our likely long term second rowers.

All depends on whether or not we can win a comp while Mann, Salmon, Kiks, Burton, Tracey, Montoya and King are at the club. The rest of our squad are young and Critter and Xerri are the likely high priority rention targets. Along with Preston, Galvin, Woods and Thompson.

For some of the players in the squad, we need to win in 2026, some others are playing for contract extensions. Young guys like Hayward, Woods and Gavin have a 5-10 year window if they stay at the club. Find a fullback and lock and we could have a settled spine for a while.

 

[Micko]

Burton to lock has more upside than almost any other player movement in our team.

Our lock plays first receiver and either passes or runs. But a kicking option there would improve our unpredictability. He suits that position perfectly. Better than Salmon or Mann potentially.