Australian news and politics.

[zimbos05]

If investors aren't allowed to buy houses and new home buyers can't afford to buy houses, builders won't build houses they cant sell... its not rocket science.

That's just false logic used to justify investors hoarding. People can buy houses. They are just being priced out of the market by investors. Investors are buying all the properties, pushing demand up, pushing prices up, and banks are offering less.

Let's be clear, these investors do not have millions of dollars to buy property. They are exploiting a system that allows them to make losses and then write it off as tax to get money. They are intentionally losing money to take tax money that isn't theirs.

 

[tsf]

Sure, now I cant speak for ALL builders obviously, but the ones I know are all crying foul and struggling to stay afloat because the cost of materials and labour is 3-4 times what it was pre-pandemic. There is a valid argument to say that they will have to increase the amount of homes they are building in order to make it profitable considering an increasing cost to themselves while having to endure lower margins.

But there IS a line where increase costs and increasing demand at lower margins is NOT sustainable... Even for the large volume builders... There is a reason why so many domestic builders have gone into liquidation in the past 24 months. I have NEVER argued that the increased cost of housing ISN'T a problem... Even from my perspective any equity I have from property is a false balloon and only serves as a vehicle to be able to lend more... its NOT a good thing. There is a generation of over-lending that is almost, but not quite, reached its bubble... Cutting a big slice of buyers out of the equation be restricting property ownership is going to do two things.

1) Create a massive glut of exiting properties that will suddenly need to be sold driving the prices down and force people with massive debt to settle at unfavourable timeframes
2) reduce the current existing rental stocks by 80-90% which will make rentals rates even higher.

Cost of housing is a massive problem but "boomer investors" is a bullshit boogyman.

Again this is all just my opinion, Im no economist/biologist/philosopher/gender studies prof like your mate.

If thats what you took out of my comment you really need to pull your head out of your arse ...

Yeah yeah, everybody but you is a cunt, we get it, you are incredibly concerned about the future generations of Australians and have made every sacrifice in your life, forgoing clothes, cars, holidays and craft beers, to provide for their future.

Those 180,000 people that came into our country this year are living where exactly now? Can you tell me?

Nobody is judging those who take advantage of it. It's just a system that is causing housing issues.

I also don't judge my mates who have other questionable sources of income

 

[zimbos05]

Those 180,000 people that came into our country this year are living where exactly now? Can you tell me?

That's not their fault. They applied to legally come to this country and got in. They'd probably have a place to stay in if investors were not hoarding property. They'd have a place to stay in if the governments of the last 10-15 years actively invested in housing and not selling off assets to the highest private bidder.

Stop blaming immigrants for a fault that isn't theirs.

 

[Muz]

Nobody is judging those who take advantage of it. It's just a system that is causing housing issues.

I also don't judge my mates who have other questionable sources of income

Which has been said about 10 times.

That's not their fault. They applied to legally come to this country and got in. They'd probably have a place to stay in if investors were not hoarding property. They'd have a place to stay in if the governments of the last 10-15 years actively invested in housing and not selling off assets to the highest private bidder.

Stop blaming immigrants for a fault that isn't theirs.

I'm not. I was making that comment as to Mono's statement that no new homes would be built if it weren't for property investors.

I 100% agree with you and have done from when this started. We're on the same page.

 

[Muz]

Monopoly was invented to demonstrate the evils of capitalism

Monopoly's inventor, Elizabeth Magie, would have sent herself straight to jail if she’d lived to see just how influential today’s twisted version of her game turned out to be.

www.bbc.com

The Bizarre History of the Monopoly Game — From Anti-Capitalist Tool to Family Favorite

We’ve all played Monopoly at some point. Some of us still have trauma from it. The game that seems to start off fun and ends in tears, upturned boards,

www.maloriesadventures.com

 

[zimbos05]

I'm not. I was making that comment as to Mono's statement that no new homes would be built if it weren't for property investors.

I 100% agree with you and have done from when this started. We're on the same page.

Was i not responding to Mono?

 

[Monoethnic Social Club]

That's just false logic used to justify investors hoarding. People can buy houses. They are just being priced out of the market by investors. Investors are buying all the properties, pushing demand up, pushing prices up, and banks are offering less.

Let's be clear, these investors do not have millions of dollars to buy property. They are exploiting a system that allows them to make losses and then write it off as tax to get money. They are intentionally losing money to take tax money that isn't theirs.

Well now you are getting closer to the true cause of housing affordability...

 

[Monoethnic Social Club]

That's not their fault. They applied to legally come to this country and got in. They'd probably have a place to stay in if investors were not hoarding property. They'd have a place to stay in if the governments of the last 10-15 years actively invested in housing and not selling off assets to the highest private bidder.

Stop blaming immigrants for a fault that isn't theirs.

??? What part of my statement did you perceive as blaming immigrants? Your barking up the wrong tree as usual here.

My argument to Muz was that these new immigrants need access to cheap housing, at least until they can afford to enter the housing market in a meaningful way themselves... If there are no houses to rent and the cost of building is sky high so any new houses are by extension sky high in price, where are these people going to live? There isnt any sufficient social housing stock anymore is THAT my fault as well?

 

[Monoethnic Social Club]

Monopoly was invented to demonstrate the evils of capitalism

Monopoly's inventor, Elizabeth Magie, would have sent herself straight to jail if she’d lived to see just how influential today’s twisted version of her game turned out to be.

www.bbc.com

The Bizarre History of the Monopoly Game — From Anti-Capitalist Tool to Family Favorite

We’ve all played Monopoly at some point. Some of us still have trauma from it. The game that seems to start off fun and ends in tears, upturned boards,

www.maloriesadventures.com

I hope you go hard on people that own stock in Liverpool and Marleybone stations and the utilities companies?

 

[Muz]

Was i not responding to Mono?

Yeah you were. My bad.

 

[Muz]

??? What part of my statement did you perceive as blaming immigrants? Your barking up the wrong tree as usual here.

My argument to Muz was that these new immigrants need access to cheap housing, at least until they can afford to enter the housing market in a meaningful way themselves... If there are no houses to rent and the cost of building is sky high so any new houses are by extension sky high in price, where are these people going to live? There isnt any sufficient social housing stock anymore is THAT my fault as well?

If the government stopped subsidising investors to the tune of billions they could use that money to ramp up social housing spending to the percentage of GDP that it was when post war immigrants came out.

 

[Monoethnic Social Club]

If the government stopped subsidising investors to the tune of billions they could use that money to ramp up social housing spending to the percentage of GDP that it was when post war immigrants came out.

Sure, government spending SHOULD be allocated by the morally outraged on certain issues and not others, that makes perfect sense.

 

[Football us life]

Bryan up the road from me, the Leeds fan, a Yorkshireman is a carpenter. Not even a proper house building carpenter. He does shop fitting and maintenance in the shop, office and other commercial property environment.

Driving a Lexus mind....$$$$$

Reckons he gets about 5 phone calls a week offering him work.

Anyway what I'm trying to say is no matter how much coin the government throws at the housing shortage crises you're still going to need a mass influx of tradesmen into Australia to even scratch the surface.

This is going to be quite difficult to solve on so many levels...

 

[Muz]

Sure, government spending SHOULD be allocated by the morally outraged on certain issues and not others, that makes perfect sense.

Is there an approved list of the things I should be morally outraged about?

Are you allowed to walk and chew gum at the same time?

Is it OK, in a discussion about housing affordability, that we can be morally outraged about 'housing affordability' and the causes behind it and what to do about it?

 

[Muz]

Bryan up the road from me, the Leeds fan, a Yorkshireman is a carpenter. Not even a proper house building carpenter. He does shop fitting and maintenance in the shop, office and other commercial property environment.

Driving a Lexus mind....$$$$$

Reckons he gets about 5 phone calls a week offering him work.

Anyway what I'm trying to say is no matter how much coin the government throws at the housing shortage crises you're still going to need a mass influx of tradesmen into Australia to even scratch the surface.

This is going to be quite difficult to solve on so many levels...

Yes. But doing nothing but nibbling at the edges is going to achieve exactly 3 fifths of fuck all.

Do you think a possible solution might be, of those 180 000 we're bringing in, to make sure that we are getting a fuckton of tradesman to build said social houses? Along with a huge government investment in rent controlled social housing?

Do you think concentrating home ownership in the hands of fewer and fewer people is a good idea?

Estimates at the moment say that private corporations will own 60% of all private residences in America in the next few decades. Is that something we want to happen here?

The Housing Crisis Monopoly: How BlackRock, Vanguard, and State Street Are Taking Over Your Neighborhood

Inside the Corporate Landlords Redefining Homeownership and Pricing Families Out of the American Dream

mikebaytoday.substack.com

If governments don't step in a do something fair dinkum the/our kids are fucked.

This 5% deposit guarantee thing they've just done for first home owners has made prices rise faster than they would have done. To absolutely no one's surprise except the boffins that came up with this hair brained scheme.

Every single thing they do such as reduced stamp duty, first home owners grants, 5% deposit schemes just pour petrol on an out of control fire.

And it's excacerbated by property investors who are outbidding first home owners. And why is that? Because when you have equity you can borrow 100% of the loan and you don't have to save.

Get rid of negative gearing, cap home investments, grandfather the rest, increase investment in social housing and reduce capital gains tax.
The system has been designed, thanks Howard, to funnel money up.

But they'll do fuck all because both sides of politics are a bunch of gutless pricks.

 

[Muz]

Bryan up the road from me, the Leeds fan, a Yorkshireman is a carpenter. Not even a proper house building carpenter. He does shop fitting and maintenance in the shop, office and other commercial property environment.

Driving a Lexus mind....$$$$$

Reckons he gets about 5 phone calls a week offering him work.

Anyway what I'm trying to say is no matter how much coin the government throws at the housing shortage crises you're still going to need a mass influx of tradesmen into Australia to even scratch the surface.

This is going to be quite difficult to solve on so many levels...

Does he whinge about migrants and the 'cost of living crisis' the poor lad is suffering from?

The amount of whinging builders I see driving big fuck off Rams, Hiluxes and Ford Rangers is out of control. They all own boats and jet skis of course. 'Oh poor bugger me I'm doing it so tough'.

Meanwhile a single mum down the road is living in a car with her 2 kids.

But yeah that's OK because I own 5 houses and they're paying themselves off.

 

[Monoethnic Social Club]

Is there an approved list of the things I should be morally outraged about?

Are you allowed to walk and chew gum at the same time?

Is it OK, in a discussion about housing affordability, that we can be morally outraged about 'housing affordability' and the causes behind it and what to do about it?

Hit a nerve did I?

 

[Muz]

Hit a nerve did I?

Absolutely not.

 

[Muz]

First-home buyer debt soars by up to $120k under guarantee scheme - realestate.com.au

Personal debts have exploded after the expansion of a flagship housing scheme and experts warn of a rising risk for homeowners.

www.realestate.com.au

 

[patjennings]

Yes. But doing nothing but nibbling at the edges is going to achieve exactly 3 fifths of fuck all.

Do you think a possible solution might be, of those 180 000 we're bringing in, to make sure that we are getting a fuckton of tradesman to build said social houses? Along with a huge government investment in rent controlled social housing?

Do you think concentrating home ownership in the hands of fewer and fewer people is a good idea?

Estimates at the moment say that private corporations will own 60% of all private residences in America in the next few decades. Is that something we want to happen here?

The Housing Crisis Monopoly: How BlackRock, Vanguard, and State Street Are Taking Over Your Neighborhood

Inside the Corporate Landlords Redefining Homeownership and Pricing Families Out of the American Dream

mikebaytoday.substack.com

If governments don't step in a do something fair dinkum the/our kids are fucked.

This 5% deposit guarantee thing they've just done for first home owners has made prices rise faster than they would have done. To absolutely no one's surprise except the boffins that came up with this hair brained scheme.

Every single thing they do such as reduced stamp duty, first home owners grants, 5% deposit schemes just pour petrol on an out of control fire.

And it's excacerbated by property investors who are outbidding first home owners. And why is that? Because when you have equity you can borrow 100% of the loan and you don't have to save.

Get rid of negative gearing, cap home investments, grandfather the rest, increase investment in social housing and reduce capital gains tax.
The system has been designed, thanks Howard, to funnel money up.

But they'll do fuck all because both sides of politics are a bunch of gutless pricks.

I know that early on after the 2019 loss Albanese told a failed candidate in northern NSW that the Shorten changes would never come back. But I see this as a similar to the stage 3 tax cuts. Albanese knows that the growing demographics are changing and the younger votes want these changes while the older voters are dying off. Expect the ALP to be doing what they can in the current framework until three to four months before the next election. If they do something now there is 2 years of negative press about why it is the wrong move. Closer to the election it will be supported for two reasons. One it is good policy and two the Liberals won't want to be seen as standing in the way that close to an election where the alternative may well be the end of the party.