Welcome!

By registering with us, you'll be able to discuss, share and private message with other members of our community.

Sign Up Now!

Soccer Ashes thread

Yes - I am reading and I have to say I agree with most of what you said in your post. As pointed out earlier and acknowledged by you it was Toure's assist.



And this is why Teague should not be in the national side, or at least in a Popovic national side. He is continually found out by teams that press hard which will likely be every team you meet at NT level - especially at a World Cup. I'm not sure about the Belgian league and his experience there but in the cooler months of the ALM when teams pressed more because of the lower temperatures his performance always dropped markedly.
Teague has been shown up now by anyone who presses. He was better near the end as I think he had the assurance of Irankunda backtracking which allowed him some handy runs in behind. Popovic made the mistake of having the midfield too deep. They get too exposed being alone. Balard or O'Neill are needed deeper to help.
 
Teague has been shown up now by anyone who presses. He was better near the end as I think he had the assurance of Irankunda backtracking which allowed him some handy runs in behind. Popovic made the mistake of having the midfield too deep. They get too exposed being alone. Balard or O'Neill are needed deeper to help.
Is the fault on Teague or are we just being outnumbered in midfield with three at the back (actual question I don't invite)?
A tough gig no matter who we pick if there is a constant midfield overload.
 
Oh well, here I'm about to post some positives about players most G and G posters love to vilify, and, some critiques of the Socceroo poster boys that identify a few flaws.

Team wise, it was very disappointing from the Roos in the first half.

However, the commentators, Robbie T and Andy H, didn't identify a few aspects of the game.

The Kiwis, like most of our recent opponents, played a high risk, high reward strategy of intensive Squeezing in our defensive half. Also, known as gegenpressing or Full Pressing and Intensive Squeezing. The aim was to force turnovers close to our defensive goal. It worked. The risk was if Aus played through the attacking and midfield lines there was a fair bit of space ceded in midfield - that could be exploited.

Bos's ball carrying and dribbling was effective at times at exploiting this space in accelerated attacks. There was too much in between the Kiwi defensive line and midfield line, or, the Kiwi defensive line was too high.

Most of the time with the relatively inexperienced Socceroos, the Kiwis game plan worked.

There were some interesting experiments by Popa.

Boyle - playing as a central striker, he has virtually no physical strength whatsoever, to contest body on body duels and hold the ball up - like Borello, Duke, Yengi and Mo Toure do.
Poor bloke is virtually useless as a central striker, apart from his diagonal runs and dummy runs to open viable passing lanes to support the the Aus ball carrier in possession. He needs to play wider on the flanks, where his tracking back and closing down of space is better in Ball Possession Opposition. Scoring regularly in the Scottish hoofball league doesn't extrapolate to international success. I think Hibs have had an early European exit.

Hrustic - in Ball Possession Opposition, he must be one of the weakest players we have had in the last decade in terms of causing turnovers from closing down space and winning body on body 1v1 duels.
On the ball shows flashes of brilliance. Despite him playing in the Eredivisie, he just doesn't work hard off the ball like fellow Dutch league players Bos and Balard.

Silvera - another quality technician, like Hrustic on the ball, but not a great ball winner in BPO. If he hadn't been injured I would have preferred Popa to play Silvera in the front three and taken Hrustic off. So to have both Hrustic on the right side of the front three and Silvera as a right wing back, gave us little ball winning impetus.

Defensive midfield - both Yazbek and Teague are inexperienced at international football. O'Neill ( inexplicably a scapegoat on this forum), as usual showed on the ball solidity in his metronomic both sides of the body proficiency two touch passing - receive with the left foot, pass with the right - receive with the right foot, pass with the left. His quick handling speed enables more security in possession.

Yazbek won some difficult hard balls, but he and Teague are too inexperienced and unfamiliar with each other, despite playing a bit at Aus U 23s, to have chemistry.

O'Neill organised players around him to assume better team defensive shape. O'Neill is also improving as a ball winner - where he is becoming dominant in 1v1s. A midfield enforcer.

As someone else has mentioned, TSF I think, Teague is a good technician on the ball, but is more one foot dominant than O'N - Teague's left.

Getting back to what Andy H and Robbie T did not identify. Usually, when teams commit to intensive Squeezing with Full Pressing, they run out of gas at the 60 min mark. They hope to have won the game by this point, then bring on a few subs.

Kiwis have improved immeasurably. Singh was excellent! My better half looked him up and he is playing in Serbia. Fast handling speed, neat on the ball, with good vision and execution.

The big Kiwi LB, De Vries, bullied Hrustic, Boyle and Silvera. Was too strong for them. It all changed when the bustling Mr Miller came on. Miller loves physical battles and has been developed in the very rugged and physical Scottish league!

Yes, Lewis commits the odd foul in dangerous places, but also wins plenty of hard balls against the opposition's best ball winners. Last night was no different. De Vries had a real battle on his hands against the rugged Miller.

The Kiwi CBs bullied Boyle. It all changed when Mo Toure came on and was a physical presence in 1v1s.

New G and G poster boy, Jordi Bos, made some superb runs on occasions. Brilliant! The only issue is what he does in between those runs? He makes more positional mistakes than JS96's idol, Aziz Behich.
Also, whereas Behich is more adept at playing to a teammates ' favourite foot, Bos often played to them, where they had to adjust so they were receiving with less than preferred ideal body shape.
Behich still has vastly superior game sense, but doesn't have Bos's ball carrying brilliance and athleticism. I almost wonder if Bos should be moved further forwards as a winger? Instead a player like Farrell could be the designated left back?

Circati - already probably Aus's best player - even with all fit and available. Could he be shifted centrally? A 3 person CB line of Geria- Circati- Souttar?

Izzo - have watched him a lot at club level, but can't remember which AL clubs he played for? Great shot stopping! Incredible saves against Wood, with two more fingertip saves. Not as good as distributor with ball on the deck as Ryan. Good debut.

Metcalfe - will have to have a good look on the stats collecting replay. Did good things, but watching live was not involved much. I'll no doubt see little things on the replay.

Aus - off the ball in BPO. Not sure why, but Popa never goes for the intensive Squeezing over a sustained period? He might apply it for short periods? It seems paramount for him for the team to hold team shape at all times in BPO.

Aus uses a Half Press with only moderate Squeezing. He uses the 3-4-3, 5-2-3, 5-4-1, formation in different parts of the pitch and whether Aus has possession or not. This means not swarming, with 2-3 players sprinting at 1 opponent to close him down and force a turnover, like our opposition has been doing to us. It gives them a lot of easy ball.

Yet again, Aus dominated in the last 20 mins and won the game. Aus finished over the top of the Kiwis.

Subs;

Unpopular G and G scapegoat, Miller, much more rugged than Silvera. Want the latter to play in the attacking line.

Unpopular G and G scapegoat, O'Neill, really strengthened the centre of midfield and won a lot of hard balls. Aus shape was better in attack and defence.

Toure - much better as central striker than Boyle. Physical presence. Notwithstanding, goal scoring ops. Provided assist to Balard (thanks Keeper).

Iran - G and G current media poster boy made some horrible defensive mistakes, but good on the ball. As many know, I love shorter players with low centre of gravity and who are nimble and quick on the turn. This is Iran in spades.

Milanovic - more effective than Hrustic. Better ball winner and more consistent on the ball, devoid of Hrustic's occasional brilliance.

Balard - looking forwards to replay to have a better look. Played one superb one touch pass under pressure to a teammate in a more defensive position.
Hope Pat J is reading this, because he thinks CCM players are hard done by from Socceroo coaches, but Balard's first touch in receiving from Iran's assist with what our former state TD calls a pivot turn, and Archie T calls a swivel turn, was brilliant - taking the ball away from his opponents and neatly slotting home that goal in the corner.
Max B looks pretty puny in the upper body ATM.

Love his attitude! MB said no matter how well he plays, he is determined to improve further at club level!

In 9 games, Popa now has 6 wins and 3 draws.

Kiwis were the better side for the first 70 mins. Just on those match stats, they deserved to win.
Nice write up. If you have easy access to the match, might you be able to time stamp one or two of Bos's shortcomings?

I felt O'Neill had a good start and end where he picked up the intensity but there were also some really weak touches in between. He's definitely good for the shape. I think he struggles in ball scramble moments but everyone did yesterday but running bad lines or feeding it to the wrong person.

Miller came on and looked at home because he's been in the system. He's still a bit of a stationary thing where he'll not get ahead like Bennie or others would. I think we need to exploit the wing back situations.

Popovic was asked whether Behich and Bos could play together and he said it's a possibility.
 
Part of me thinks, NZ pressed liken hell but they weren't exactly rewarded for it. They'll be more frustrated. Australia did have some good movement and half chances throughout the game. Just a practice run this.
 
Part of me thinks, NZ pressed liken hell but they weren't exactly rewarded for it. They'll be more frustrated. Australia did have some good movement and half chances throughout the game. Just a practice run this.
I reckon the next game in Auckland NZ would have worked out the Socceroos' and should by right get a few goals before half time. Know whats on the bench the All Whites coach will make better subs to counter the likes of Irakunda etc. (Hope i spelled that right).
 
Popovic was asked whether Behich and Bos could play together and he said it's a possibility.
I've only just watched that interview a couple of minutes ago. I pretty much agree with what Popovic said. If he decides to use a genuine back 3 with the wing backs expected to go forward regularly as an attacking option Bos is the best option. If he decides that a back 5 is more appropriate then Behich is probably the better option at left back, and we could (should) use Bos in a more advanced role. It will be interesting to see what sort of side he fields in New Zealand. With friendlies like this and a lot of squad members who haven't been regulars I think its important to give all of them some meaningful game time ie at least 30 minutes. Although Balard did well with his 5 minutes that shouldn't be his only appearance in these games. I don't care if we lose, as long as these guys get a decent chance to show their skills and get some experience.
 
I reckon the next game in Auckland NZ would have worked out the Socceroos' and should by right get a few goals before half time. Know whats on the bench the All Whites coach will make better subs to counter the likes of Irakunda etc. (Hope i spelled that right).

Forget about the style of play we had which I did not like. The one thing I do like is the depth across both squads. We have a number of players out, Ryan, Souttar, Irvine, plus more and NZ probably have at least 3 or 4 players that were unavailable as well.

In my memory probably the highest level squads (across both squads - not one or the other).
 


Was nervous recording before watching the replay. But I think we got it mostly right.

One thing id correct after watching the replay - hrustic is clearly putting more effort in, but unfortunately still struggles off the ball
 
Another thing i picked up when watching the replay is poppa would on occasion transition from a back 5 to a back 4. In a couple of cases circati would be high and wide in the rb position with silvera up at winger and hrustic at cam
A couple of other times circati joined the midfield with silvera dropping back

I guess the theory is to give more of a role to circati, but it adds more complexity to his system when you are bringing new players in

Off the ball I also saw players open the same passing lane, so in some cases it wasnt so much us getting outnumbered, but if 4 players only open 2 passing lanes then that only takes 2 players to block. So some cohesion issues
 
Oh well, here I'm about to post some positives about players most G and G posters love to vilify, and, some critiques of the Socceroo poster boys that identify a few flaws.

Team wise, it was very disappointing from the Roos in the first half.

However, the commentators, Robbie T and Andy H, didn't identify a few aspects of the game.

The Kiwis, like most of our recent opponents, played a high risk, high reward strategy of intensive Squeezing in our defensive half. Also, known as gegenpressing or Full Pressing and Intensive Squeezing. The aim was to force turnovers close to our defensive goal. It worked. The risk was if Aus played through the attacking and midfield lines there was a fair bit of space ceded in midfield - that could be exploited.

Bos's ball carrying and dribbling was effective at times at exploiting this space in accelerated attacks. There was too much in between the Kiwi defensive line and midfield line, or, the Kiwi defensive line was too high.

Most of the time with the relatively inexperienced Socceroos, the Kiwis game plan worked.

There were some interesting experiments by Popa.

Boyle - playing as a central striker, he has virtually no physical strength whatsoever, to contest body on body duels and hold the ball up - like Borello, Duke, Yengi and Mo Toure do.
Poor bloke is virtually useless as a central striker, apart from his diagonal runs and dummy runs to open viable passing lanes to support the the Aus ball carrier in possession. He needs to play wider on the flanks, where his tracking back and closing down of space is better in Ball Possession Opposition. Scoring regularly in the Scottish hoofball league doesn't extrapolate to international success. I think Hibs have had an early European exit.

Hrustic - in Ball Possession Opposition, he must be one of the weakest players we have had in the last decade in terms of causing turnovers from closing down space and winning body on body 1v1 duels.
On the ball shows flashes of brilliance. Despite him playing in the Eredivisie, he just doesn't work hard off the ball like fellow Dutch league players Bos and Balard.

Silvera - another quality technician, like Hrustic on the ball, but not a great ball winner in BPO. If he hadn't been injured I would have preferred Popa to play Silvera in the front three and taken Hrustic off. So to have both Hrustic on the right side of the front three and Silvera as a right wing back, gave us little ball winning impetus.

Defensive midfield - both Yazbek and Teague are inexperienced at international football. O'Neill ( inexplicably a scapegoat on this forum), as usual showed on the ball solidity in his metronomic both sides of the body proficiency two touch passing - receive with the left foot, pass with the right - receive with the right foot, pass with the left. His quick handling speed enables more security in possession.

Yazbek won some difficult hard balls, but he and Teague are too inexperienced and unfamiliar with each other, despite playing a bit at Aus U 23s, to have chemistry.

O'Neill organised players around him to assume better team defensive shape. O'Neill is also improving as a ball winner - where he is becoming dominant in 1v1s. A midfield enforcer.

As someone else has mentioned, TSF I think, Teague is a good technician on the ball, but is more one foot dominant than O'N - Teague's left.

Getting back to what Andy H and Robbie T did not identify. Usually, when teams commit to intensive Squeezing with Full Pressing, they run out of gas at the 60 min mark. They hope to have won the game by this point, then bring on a few subs.

Kiwis have improved immeasurably. Singh was excellent! My better half looked him up and he is playing in Serbia. Fast handling speed, neat on the ball, with good vision and execution.

The big Kiwi LB, De Vries, bullied Hrustic, Boyle and Silvera. Was too strong for them. It all changed when the bustling Mr Miller came on. Miller loves physical battles and has been developed in the very rugged and physical Scottish league!

Yes, Lewis commits the odd foul in dangerous places, but also wins plenty of hard balls against the opposition's best ball winners. Last night was no different. De Vries had a real battle on his hands against the rugged Miller.

The Kiwi CBs bullied Boyle. It all changed when Mo Toure came on and was a physical presence in 1v1s.

New G and G poster boy, Jordi Bos, made some superb runs on occasions. Brilliant! The only issue is what he does in between those runs? He makes more positional mistakes than JS96's idol, Aziz Behich.
Also, whereas Behich is more adept at playing to a teammates ' favourite foot, Bos often played to them, where they had to adjust so they were receiving with less than preferred ideal body shape.
Behich still has vastly superior game sense, but doesn't have Bos's ball carrying brilliance and athleticism. I almost wonder if Bos should be moved further forwards as a winger? Instead a player like Farrell could be the designated left back?

Circati - already probably Aus's best player - even with all fit and available. Could he be shifted centrally? A 3 person CB line of Geria- Circati- Souttar?

Izzo - have watched him a lot at club level, but can't remember which AL clubs he played for? Great shot stopping! Incredible saves against Wood, with two more fingertip saves. Not as good as distributor with ball on the deck as Ryan. Good debut.

Metcalfe - will have to have a good look on the stats collecting replay. Did good things, but watching live was not involved much. I'll no doubt see little things on the replay.

Aus - off the ball in BPO. Not sure why, but Popa never goes for the intensive Squeezing over a sustained period? He might apply it for short periods? It seems paramount for him for the team to hold team shape at all times in BPO.

Aus uses a Half Press with only moderate Squeezing. He uses the 3-4-3, 5-2-3, 5-4-1, formation in different parts of the pitch and whether Aus has possession or not. This means not swarming, with 2-3 players sprinting at 1 opponent to close him down and force a turnover, like our opposition has been doing to us. It gives them a lot of easy ball.

Yet again, Aus dominated in the last 20 mins and won the game. Aus finished over the top of the Kiwis.

Subs;

Unpopular G and G scapegoat, Miller, much more rugged than Silvera. Want the latter to play in the attacking line.

Unpopular G and G scapegoat, O'Neill, really strengthened the centre of midfield and won a lot of hard balls. Aus shape was better in attack and defence.

Toure - much better as central striker than Boyle. Physical presence. Notwithstanding, goal scoring ops. Provided assist to Balard (thanks Keeper).

Iran - G and G current media poster boy made some horrible defensive mistakes, but good on the ball. As many know, I love shorter players with low centre of gravity and who are nimble and quick on the turn. This is Iran in spades.

Milanovic - more effective than Hrustic. Better ball winner and more consistent on the ball, devoid of Hrustic's occasional brilliance.

Balard - looking forwards to replay to have a better look. Played one superb one touch pass under pressure to a teammate in a more defensive position.
Hope Pat J is reading this, because he thinks CCM players are hard done by from Socceroo coaches, but Balard's first touch in receiving from Iran's assist with what our former state TD calls a pivot turn, and Archie T calls a swivel turn, was brilliant - taking the ball away from his opponents and neatly slotting home that goal in the corner.
Max B looks pretty puny in the upper body ATM.

Love his attitude! MB said no matter how well he plays, he is determined to improve further at club level!

In 9 games, Popa now has 6 wins and 3 draws.

Kiwis were the better side for the first 70 mins. Just on those match stats, they deserved to win.
Agree with most of that, though even on replay i didnt notice any horrid defensive mistakes from irankunda but i did see 2 from yazbek/teague 1 from oniell and lot from hrustic. Having said that oniell made a big difference

Having metcalf on the same flank as bos probably gives him a lot of freedom, not much attack came down that side
 
Pull on the All Whites shirt and your quality drops about 20%
With the way NZ dominated the midfield you would think they should play with 2 strikers, just relying on Wood was a bad move but i think they will get it right cum the Auckland game.
 
With the way NZ dominated the midfield you would think they should play with 2 strikers, just relying on Wood was a bad move but i think they will get it right cum the Auckland game.
Yeah 5:0 or something right? Dominating midfield us just like superior possession. You've got to actually do something with it.
 
I saw the Popa press conference I must say it was disappointing he didn’t acknowledge that we got outplayed by New Zealand for most of the game almost like he was content with how we played, it’s clear he’s so stubborn with he’s 343/541 and won’t deviate from it.
 
Teague has been shown up now by anyone who presses. He was better near the end as I think he had the assurance of Irankunda backtracking which allowed him some handy runs in behind. Popovic made the mistake of having the midfield too deep. They get too exposed being alone. Balard or O'Neill are needed deeper to help.
The system doesn’t help, any midfield option would have struggled in similar conditions.
 
I saw the Popa press conference I must say it was disappointing he didn’t acknowledge that we got outplayed by New Zealand for most of the game almost like he was content with how we played, it’s clear he’s so stubborn with he’s 343/541 and won’t deviate from it.
well he doesn't value possession or territory very highly, so whether nz dominated depends on your philosophy. If we played 4-3-3 and tried to dominate possession and territory and failed, then yeah he would have to concede that
 
well he doesn't value possession or territory very highly, so whether nz dominated depends on your philosophy. If we played 4-3-3 and tried to dominate possession and territory and failed, then yeah he would have to concede that
I highly doubt we would have failed given what we have in disposal given we played a team 82nd in the world, it poses larger questions on the overall direction of the national team anything else.
 
Last edited:
I highly doubt we would have failed given what we have in disposal given we played a team 82nd in the world, it poses larger questions on the overall direction of the national team anything else.
Yeah nearly every coach in australia tries to dominate possession so we have someone quite unusual in charge

The back five means if you pin our wing backs with wide attackers there is an achre of space for opposition fullbacks and the central midfielders are out numbered 2 to 3. Then when we have posession we dont start recycling and patientiently bulding through the thirds until around the 60 minute mark (as @Decentric points out when the opposition press starts to run out of steam)

In posession we either try quick positive forward passing sequences or long passes to break the press. But that means our possession phases are short

We also only press high when a trigger happens

All this means conceding possession and aussies who have been taught possession based philosophy for over a decade think we are being dominated

It is pretty odd tho having a national style implemented from the top down and having a national coach go againdy it :D
 
Back
Top