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2027 Asian Cup

Decentric said:
Including McGree, I can barely see any current 27 yo plus Aus outfielders being able to keep the players aged under 25 out of the Roo first 11 in the next 18 months.

The technical skill set of the younger gen is significantly greater than the older Gen all across the pitch.
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Completely echo this sentiment, and it's something I've been thinking about a bit. Surely our under 24 team would beat, more times than not, our over 24 team at the moment? It'd be something like (and adopting Poppa's formation, which I wouldn't do if given the choice):

GK: Beach
LWB: Bos
RWB: Italiano
LCB: Herrington
CB: Circati
RCB: Trewin
CM: Robertson
CM: Okon-Engstler/Yazbek
LW: Velupillay/Younis
RW: Irankunda
CF: Toure

vs

GK: Ryan
LWB: Behich
RWB: Karacic
LCB: Burgess
CB: Souttar
RCB: Degenek/Geria (though I'd probably choose Stensness)
CM: Metcalfe
CM: Irvine
LW: McGree
RW: Boyle/Mabil
CF: Juric

The only real obvious weak point of the more junior team is Velupillay/Younis (though I'm very optimistic about the latter on current form), the inexperienced (though not necessarily worse) CMs and Patrick Beach in goal. However, the CBs and wingbacks are strong and there are more goals in the junior team.

What absolutely boils my piss is how much stronger the younger team would be if you added Triantis (instead of Trewin maybe?) and either Segecic or Volpato (instead of Velupillay, and by some distance).

Ultimately, the Socceroos should be much stronger by the time the world cup 2030 rolls around. All the young guys will have another four years under their belt (including guys like Dylan Leonard and Dan Bennie) and most of our better overs 25s will still be a great age (Souttar, Metcalfe and McGree particularly).
 
Toebash said:
Completely echo this sentiment, and it's something I've been thinking about a bit. Surely our under 24 team would beat, more times than not, our over 24 team at the moment? It'd be something like (and adopting Poppa's formation, which I wouldn't do if given the choice):

GK: Beach
LWB: Bos
RWB: Italiano
LCB: Herrington
CB: Circati
RCB: Trewin
CM: Robertson
CM: Okon-Engstler/Yazbek
LW: Velupillay/Younis
RW: Irankunda
CF: Toure

vs

GK: Ryan
LWB: Behich
RWB: Karacic
LCB: Burgess
CB: Souttar
RCB: Degenek/Geria (though I'd probably choose Stensness)
CM: Metcalfe
CM: Irvine
LW: McGree
RW: Boyle/Mabil
CF: Juric

The only real obvious weak point of the more junior team is Velupillay/Younis (though I'm very optimistic about the latter on current form), the inexperienced (though not necessarily worse) CMs and Patrick Beach in goal. However, the CBs and wingbacks are strong and there are more goals in the junior team.

What absolutely boils my piss is how much stronger the younger team would be if you added Triantis (instead of Trewin maybe?) and either Segecic or Volpato (instead of Velupillay, and by some distance).

Ultimately, the Socceroos should be much stronger by the time the world cup 2030 rolls around. All the young guys will have another four years under their belt (including guys like Dylan Leonard and Dan Bennie) and most of our better overs 25s will still be a great age (Souttar, Metcalfe and McGree particularly).
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Echo nearly every sentiment you've expressed, except that given I've mainly observed Triantis in the Aus u23 settings as a CB, or chasing a dominant Celtic around the pitch, I'm not sure he is better than Trewin? Trewin can play RWB ( better than I thought), DM and CB too.

The teams you've picked are pretty close to the best Roo elevens aged 26-7 and over and under 25 best elevens. Also, Leonard may be in the starting u25 line up as a CB instead of Trewin soon.

I've watched Melb City play a lot recently, including ACL. Younis is the fastest ever Aussie I've seen, to turn with the ball with initial body position facing backwards, to body shape facing forwards, as he receives it. Younis likes opposition teams to play a high line, and use his pace to exploit.

Whereas they use Arzani on the left wing. Arzani's right foot crossing is better on the right flank, and he likes a lot of traffic for fast passing and moving exchanges and dribbling in tight spaces, and has an immense football brain and deft skill. Compared to Younis, his athleticism, or lack of, shows up.

I can't see Souttar, Metcalfe and McGree holding the tyros out either.

One older player who has done better for the Roos than club, is Yengi.
 
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LFC said:
can only be Kusini.
I agree with D here, he actually has done ok 11 appearances return of 6 goals.
He's strong and a mover.
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Agree he's done OK for the Roos, but that was a while ago (before the Aberdeen disaster) and now that we've got Toure I think he's surplus to requirements. He certainly doesn't deserve to make the World Cup squad over Juric (who looked fine, rather than good) and Duke.
 
LFC said:
can only be Kusini.
I agree with D here, he actually has done ok 11 appearances return of 6 goals.
He's strong and a mover.
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It often happens.

For mine Yengi has looked better as a national team forward than Boyle and Hrustic, despite the latter duo having done far better at club level than Yengi.

6 goals from 11 games is outstanding!

Maybe a AL return with an accompanying ACL spot? That equates to 34 - 38 games per season. Could Jets recruit Yengi for next season?
 
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Toebash said:
Agree he's done OK for the Roos, but that was a while ago (before the Aberdeen disaster) and now that we've got Toure I think he's surplus to requirements. He certainly doesn't deserve to make the World Cup squad over Juric (who looked fine, rather than good) and Duke.
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I have had a good look at Juric in stats and data.

He has done well, apart from getting into position to score. He has had a very poor shooting at goal output. Similar to Mark Viduka for the Roos.

In build up play Juric has been great!

Also, I think it is important not to let club coaches overseas, often worse trained and with less experience than domestic Aus national team coaches, determine Socceroo selection.
 
Toebash said:
Agree he's done OK for the Roos, but that was a while ago (before the Aberdeen disaster) and now that we've got Toure I think he's surplus to requirements. He certainly doesn't deserve to make the World Cup squad over Juric (who looked fine, rather than good) and Duke.
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Look there is no doubt Toure has taken the opportunity with both hands and fits - we've lacked a striker like him despite what Duke had done prior.
Juric early days but also agree well worth a spot - Yengi is a useful back up IF he performs when given the chance.
I wouldn't even bother with Boyle/Hrustic as D sees in his paralysis analysis viewing.
I see it just by watching the games "live" could save him alot of time hahaha
 
LFC said:
Look there is no doubt Toure has taken the opportunity with both hands and fits - we've lacked a striker like him despite what Duke had done prior.
Juric early days but also agree well worth a spot - Yengi is a useful back up IF he performs when given the chance.
I wouldn't even bother with Boyle/Hrustic as D sees in his paralysis analysis viewing.
I see it just by watching the games "live" could save him alot of time hahaha
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See the great thing about Australian football at the moment is the serious explosion of depth we've had. I'm not too bothered as to whether Yengi makes it or not, because we've got Goodwin, Waddingham, Botic, Jovanovic, Caputo, Tete Yengi and probably others waiting in the wings that I've forgotten (along with the obvious Toure, Juric and Irankunda) who will be jostling for positions by the time the Asian Cup rolls around next year. Obviously I wish Yengi the best, but you don't have to sweat about it in the same way we did previously.
 
Toebash said:
Agree he's done OK for the Roos, but that was a while ago (before the Aberdeen disaster) and now that we've got Toure I think he's surplus to requirements. He certainly doesn't deserve to make the World Cup squad over Juric (who looked fine, rather than good) and Duke.
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K. Yengi is injured so won't make the WC. It's a shame he wasn't fit to push his claim. If he did well in Japan he'd be in contention.
 
patjennings said:
My only problem with the younger team is Beach. There is a huge drop after Ryan and Beach is not the answer. May be a good ALM keeper but he is not the NT answer.
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I think Patrick Beach needs more game time to develop as part of the national team setup before he can succeed Ryan as starting Socceroos keeper but he should be able to improve to a high enough standard in the near future.
 
Frankly Speaking said:
Oar was an odd one... had all the moves of an out and out winger without the pace to pull them off
I recall seeing him play a number of times at Suncorp and wondering what the hype was about.
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My experience of it was you had a GG squad who were old. Very little new talent had broken through for years, partly due to Pim, partly due to a lack of talent coming through. Definitely no talent at the level of the GG. Oar was the hope.

Toebash said:
See the great thing about Australian football at the moment is the serious explosion of depth we've had. I'm not too bothered as to whether Yengi makes it or not, because we've got Goodwin, Waddingham, Botic, Jovanovic, Caputo, Tete Yengi and probably others waiting in the wings that I've forgotten (along with the obvious Toure, Juric and Irankunda) who will be jostling for positions by the time the Asian Cup rolls around next year. Obviously I wish Yengi the best, but you don't have to sweat about it in the same way we did previously.
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I think this is an interesting point. There is depth and a good deal of talent coming through. I would say most of it is at a mid tier level (at this point), differs position to position and with the amount of experience for each of these guys. Looking at that list you gave, I think you can throw a blanket over them, it is unclear who is going to progress and set themselves apart. This is one of the challenges for Popa, to identify which of these kids will take the step forward. And the same thing is true in a number of positions.

Where we don't have depth is with guys who are higher quality players. Bos, Toure, Irvine, Cicati etc. The drop off back to the next much larger group of potentials is fairly large.
 
Cunningstunt said:
My experience of it was you had a GG squad who were old. Very little new talent had broken through for years, partly due to Pim, partly due to a lack of talent coming through. Definitely no talent at the level of the GG. Oar was the hope.


I think this is an interesting point. There is depth and a good deal of talent coming through. I would say most of it is at a mid tier level (at this point), differs position to position and with the amount of experience for each of these guys. Looking at that list you gave, I think you can throw a blanket over them, it is unclear who is going to progress and set themselves apart. This is one of the challenges for Popa, to identify which of these kids will take the step forward. And the same thing is true in a number of positions.

Where we don't have depth is with guys who are higher quality players. Bos, Toure, Irvine, Cicati etc. The drop off back to the next much larger group of potentials is fairly large.
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Agree 100% with this post - very few potential first tier talents.

What I could never understand in regard to Tommy Oar was the way so many commentators talked about his pace. Having seen him and Michael Zullo on the pitch at the same time over a number of games, Oar conspicuously lacked Zullo's pace, and yet was promoted onto the wing by Ange in preference to Zullo. It was absolutely mystifying. Interestingly, in the Netherlands he was played as a 10.

Ange was Oar's number one promoter. Talked him up relentlessly. Sitting in the stands, I could never see it.

The "new Kewell" he was not. Around that time another player had that rotting albatross of a label hang around their neck too and conspicuously failed to live up to it - David Williams.

Its like a muso being called the "new Dylan" - absolute kiss of death.
 
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Cunningstunt said:
My experience of it was you had a GG squad who were old. Very little new talent had broken through for years, partly due to Pim, partly due to a lack of talent coming through. Definitely no talent at the level of the GG. Oar was the hope.
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I don't think it had anything to do with Pim. He gave quite a few youngsters and second tier players a chance, mainly because we played a few out of window games, but not a lot of them rose to the occasion. The next crop was just a bit weaker all round. Now if you mentioned Holger as a cause I would agree with you. He stuck with quite a few of the GG when some should have been moved on and others just play a supporting role offering experience and mentorship.
 
rebelliousfeminist974 said:
I think Patrick Beach needs more game time to develop as part of the national team setup before he can succeed Ryan as starting Socceroos keeper but he should be able to improve to a high enough standard in the near future.
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No - better keepers than Beach - and some of them younger - some of them older. To my mind he won't be one of the three going forward. If he is we are in trouble.
 
Alex M said:
I don't think it had anything to do with Pim. He gave quite a few youngsters and second tier players a chance, mainly because we played a few out of window games, but not a lot of them rose to the occasion. The next crop was just a bit weaker all round. Now if you mentioned Holger as a cause I would agree with you. He stuck with quite a few of the GG when some should have been moved on and others just play a supporting role offering experience and mentorship.
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Debut was the wrong word. I forgot he had those games. He didn't integrate new players into the first team squad, particularly outside of those matches. This was a lost generation at the death of the NSL and the transition into Aliga. Holger was worse as the GG were far older at this point.
 
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