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Green & Gold FC podcast

Pasquali said:
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Another good podcast!

Nice to see you on video, NCB! Both you and Aaron were interesting guests speaking about governance in Capital Football and the effect on feeder clubs.

Nic, your image disappeared frequently and was replaced by a blue and yellow emblem, so we couldn't see you on video.

I'm always disappointed to see that Capital Football, as the peak body in the area, have declined to participate in this Podcast. If it is definite, I'll write to Capital Football and state this to the CEO.

Are Thomas Crossley and Pat McCann still involved in CF?

I'm shocked to hear Aaron quote it costs $1400-1500 to play a season for 13 yos!

Good hosting, active listening and appropriate questions posed by Graham and Alex.
 
Decentric said:
Another good podcast!

Nice to see you on video, NCB! Both you and Aaron were interesting guests speaking about governance in Capital Football and the effect on feeder clubs.

Nic, your image disappeared frequently and was replaced by a blue and yellow emblem, so we couldn't see you on video.

I'm always disappointed to see that Capital Football, as the peak body in the area, have declined to participate in this Podcast. If it is definite, I'll write to Capital Football and state this to the CEO.

Are Thomas Crossley and Pat McCann still involved in CF?

I'm shocked to hear Aaron quote it costs $1400-1500 to play a season for 13 yos!

Good hosting, active listening and appropriate questions posed by Graham and Alex.
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D - thats pretty standard cost when your in SAP/YL up here.
Paid as such for years for my sons, then expensive boots, year to year.
You only get some release as they near Snr's and forward that the Club see's the potential to be a start up player, then you get that behind the clubhouse discussion that they'll cover rego moving ahead.
This is even done being a main player in Prem1's, the club covers the key players.
How the cookie crumbles.
 
LFC said:
D - thats pretty standard cost when your in SAP/YL up here.
Paid as such for years for my sons, then expensive boots, year to year.
You only get some release as they near Snr's and forward that the Club see's the potential to be a start up player, then you get that behind the clubhouse discussion that they'll cover rego moving ahead.
This is even done being a main player in Prem1's, the club covers the key players.
How the cookie crumbles.
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A few years back it cost circa $400 to play Men’s Senior NPL in the state league in Tas, LFC.

That price of $1400- 1500 must be driving youth away in droves!
 
Decentric said:
A few years back it cost circa $400 to play Men’s Senior NPL in the state league in Tas, LFC.

That price of $1400- 1500 must be driving youth away in droves!
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Its costing $450 a season to play any Snr football on avg nowadays D - has been for years.

Re SAP/YL, it may drive some away but there also is many others who keep paying these stupid rip off costs of $14/1500 up.
Its a Catch22 scenario, so many yummy mummys think they have budding CR7's when they are not - its all about the show for some.
 
LFC said:
Its costing $450 a season to play any Snr football on avg nowadays D - has been for years.

Re SAP/YL, it may drive some away but there also is many others who keep paying these stupid rip off costs of $14/1500 up.
Its a Catch22 scenario, so many yummy mummys think they have budding CR7's when they are not - its all about the show for some.
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250 pounds a season for amateurs is normal here, so less worried about that than junior costs
 
Decentric said:
Another good podcast!

Nice to see you on video, NCB! Both you and Aaron were interesting guests speaking about governance in Capital Football and the effect on feeder clubs.

Nic, your image disappeared frequently and was replaced by a blue and yellow emblem, so we couldn't see you on video.

I'm always disappointed to see that Capital Football, as the peak body in the area, have declined to participate in this Podcast. If it is definite, I'll write to Capital Football and state this to the CEO.

Are Thomas Crossley and Pat McCann still involved in CF?

I'm shocked to hear Aaron quote it costs $1400-1500 to play a season for 13 yos!

Good hosting, active listening and appropriate questions posed by Graham and Alex.
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Yeah - I was using my work laptop since that's the only thing I had with a webcam, and then it decided it wanted to spaz out and lock out the camera after.. what, 15 minutes I think?

I think after having a bit of discussion with new user Common Sense in the main Capital Football Changes thread, it's become a bit clearer that this review has sort of conflated two issues into one - Junior boys league structure, and Senior mens league structure.

I think I've come around a little bit that a 10 club NPLY league can work - provided that it's only an 18 game H+A season. Given that the only non-local side in NPLY and Junior League (I'm defining non-local as anything outside of ACT, and the Southern Tablelands/Yass/Goulburn/Cooma/etc area) is Wagga, there's mechanisms in place for these clubs to at least get back in to the premier Junior divisions - even if I don't agree with it.

In terms of Seniors.. well.. something is still fishy to me. I held back a little bit in the podcast, because Aaron and Monaro Panthers graciously accepted an invite to speak their piece and put their opinions out - so I wanted to give them a bit of air time. I can always come back on if Wagga are still keen to jump on board (I had arranged for someone from the club to come on as well, but have mysteriously not heard back from them since...), and Yoogali (who I am aware have people in the club who want to speak up, but don't want to ruffle any feathers until they have confirmed where on earth they are going to play next season).

But essentially, this is what it boils down to for me: The review itself is heavily flawed and hypocritical - and that's where the issue lies. A lot of this I've covered in the Capital Football Changes thread.

The many things hypocritical about this review - and that's just in the document itself:
  • Riverina excluded mostly on the basis that 'community and junior players are not willing to travel beyond the previous Capital Football region limits of Cooma, Yass and Goulburn and will subsequently forfeit matches, which significantly impacts on the integrity of the competition and the experience had by all participants' - including a rejection to join the league by Hanwood FC (who arguably has a stronger youth set up than Yoogali SC). Nontheless, Wagga was given an exemption for only the youth team, despite the review stating that it's youth teams that have/will struggle to travel.
  • In addition to travel, it was cited that "there is an ongoing challenge for all clubs with the distance, cost, player availability and availability of referees to travel to the Riverina." I know for a fact that referees in the Riverina are crying out for courses/training to be qualified at that level - and it's not like Capital Football has turned a blind eye in allocating 'unqualified' referees at this level - I was at the lowest end of the Capital Football totem pole while refereeing (Level 4), and had been assigned AR duties for 3 NPL/CPL games in a season, which would generally require Level 3 qualifications. Was this a one-off because I had been involved in NPL/CPL on the dugout for the previous 3-4 seasons? Perhaps. But nonetheless, the resources are there if eyes are opened. If clubs are so worried about travel, why are they entering in competitions such as the Hahn Australia Cup and Australian Championship which will require cross-country travel and larger expenses?
  • Introduction of a preseason competition involving the Illawarra Premier League - stated as having NPL teams playing 4 matches against IPL clubs (2x home and 2x away), which goes against the reasoning for excluding Riverina clubs due to travel time - as a 10 club NPLM competition including Yoogali would have been less travel for clubs than this slated preseason competition
  • Reduction of NPLB to 10 teams (overall a reduction due to this year's combined competition), with clubs now being cut from the competition. However, the review states that a longer 27-28 round season for NPL Boys and Girls will take place, citing that "The longer season was allocated to the Boys and Girls competition as it will have the greater impact on the player development pathway and it is also where ground allocations are more flexible." Wouldn't it make more sense to keep the current larger competition, where a home and away season would still provide that longer season?
  • Then you also have one section of the review's Final Report that completely contradicts itself within two sentences: 'The Review Committee don’t believe it is required to link competitions. However, it is recommended that it is a requirement for all NPL Men’s and Women’s clubs to have a junior pathway and teams entered in either the NPL or in each Junior League Div 1 competitions that are aligned to their first grade program.'
  • It appears as if Capital Football has attempted make a 'catch-all' for requirements, but allowed certain clubs to be exempt and/or rise through the cracks. For example, Canberra Juventus haven't been granted an exemption:
    Canberra Juventus’ request for a junior pathway exemption has been denied. The Board expressed concern over the feasibility of establishing a full junior pathway within a 12-month timeframe. The club is encouraged to plan for future NPL promotion by developing its youth structure.
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    Even though the Exemption Guidelines place this as a requirement to build towards meeting criteria for the 2027 season. If they're able to establish their pathway by the end of next season (and they've already put in place steps to do) - the fact that they won't be promoted to NPLM next season ahead of Brindabella Blues (3rd in CPL Club Championship v 5th) will be a joke. But that's a watch this space I suppose.

And that's not to mention the integrity concerns that have cropped up across the perceived lack of communication and consultation, and censorship of some people speaking out against this review - myself included - which include:
  • A current club committee member being 25% of the review panel (and seemingly the largest beneficiary of this review) with no conflict of interest being tabled or mentioned in the review.
  • The Capital Football President seemingly ignoring (or not checking his email) to pass on a letter recommending the implementation of this review be paused for 12 months - signed off on by 75% of the NPLM + CPLM clubs - with the CEO of Capital Football only acknowledging receipt of this letter the day after exemptions were announced - 4 weeks after it was sent (with this acknowledgment of receipt also confirming that this letter was not looked at until this point).
  • Capital Football censoring/blocking select users on social media from commenting on items relating to this without following their social media policy, then trying to apply sanctions based on this social media policy to clubs (probably rightly to be honest, but is very hypocritical when they won't stick to their own policy), and only overturning this as a "gesture of goodwill" when mentions of Football Australia's Integrity Unit were raised.
There is quite a deep perception out that way (Riverina) that a lot of these changes have been made purely to remove Riverina clubs from the senior pyramid. This is now the 3rd time that this has happened to the region in the past 55 years (and of those, at least 2 were against the will of the Riverina region). We've had some clubs mention that they were made aware and had communication, but it appears as if Yoogali and Wagga did not until the last minute.

Of the 9 seasons that Yoogali, Riverina Rhinos and Wagga City have competed in the men's senior pyramid, only once have any of them finished last (Rhinos in 2019, which led to Yoogali being introduced in the second tier for 2020).

And another thing to note - which has also been mentioned in my article (cheap plug) - is just how forgotten Riverina and Southern NSW is when it comes to football. Like I said earlier, it's the third time this has happened in relation to Canberra. But across 2017 and 2018's NPL (and connected leagues) seasons, 3 of the 4 Riverina associations (Griffith, Wagga and Albury) all had an 'association club' (a team run by the association - essentially a representative team) playing in 3 different NPL (or lower connected leagues) structures - Wagga in NSW, Griffith in ACT, and Albury in Victoria. Until we know just where Murray United's application to join the Victorian State League structure sits, for 2025 that's a big fat zero.

Yoogali put motions in place to meet criteria - but I think it's been made obvious that Capital Football just don't want to go there. Yoogali have juniors playing in Griffith. Which - as Capital Football rightly pointed out - travel for youth football is an issue. Which is a shame, because as I mentioned earlier - to compete at this level, Riverina clubs either have Melbourne or Sydney to travel to - both further than Canberra. So from a regional development perspective - being in the Canberra pyramid makes the most sense. But more on that a little later.

If anything, personally, the two tiered "Premier Leagues" have been more of a success since the youth/senior decoupling occurred in 2020, than it was in the few years prior to that. Closing clubs off from the top tier does nothing for progress - and that's what this proposed system does.

The review championed the way promotion/relegation has meant more meaning for games in the top tier, but then have also subsequently closed it off by only having a conditional system that means clubs like Olympic, and Belconnen never get relegated again.

Personally, Capital Football - if they're going to be bandying exemptions around for a 2027 implementation of this 10 team structure, should have implemented this 10 club/single tier approach to begin from 2027, rather than 2026, giving clubs ample time to get their houses in order. This review was announced in the middle of May, with applications for criteria/exemptions closing in mid-June. It's clear a majority of the clubs thought this too - given the letter signed by 12 of the 16 NPLM/CPLM clubs that was sent (and lost in Capital Football's email filter) - and probably would have been an acceptable middle ground.

It would alleviated the criticism they've copped from the Riverina (and other clubs in Canberra that are affected), and given clubs in Canberra to either address the criteria or not - or in the situation that Yoogali and Wagga have found themselves in, more time to find themselves a sustainable home.

Capital Football want to champion growth of this league, and overall - these changes do more to hamper it than help. And the issue very much here is with them. In hindsight, the criticism faced on Canberra Olympic in this.. is a bit harsh. At the end of the day, if a 10 club NPL was going to be introduced regardless of keeping Yoogali and Wagga around, they still finished top 2. I've laid my criticisms out of other clubs pretty openly. I do recall some people associated from that club (just to be clear - not Olympic) insinuating that certain clubs were specifically not invited to sign this letter/email to Capital Football - which I find a bit silly to make that insinuation at all. What benefit would this batch of clubs have from not having another number potentially join them?

Going back to what I spoke about earlier - if I had my perfect world: Capital Football would absorb the 'Riverina Branch' and some surrounding associations that Football NSW just don't care about (Southern Tablelands as one example). Let the associations exist on their own merit, holding their own competitions, etc locally like they do now - but allow each association the ability (like they had with Wagga, and previously with Southern Tablelands United for Goulburn) compete in the Premier League structure (which is why a two-tier pyramid is perfect - even if it still has that conditional promotion/relegation) through an association team. If those associations have their own politics that hold things back (looking at you Griffith with Riverina Rhinos), then so be it - they can deal with that on their own level before they get into the structure. And if things fall apart - then they're removed until they sort their shit out.

But - ultimately - that last paragraph is dreamland and will never happen.
 
Pasquali said:

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Another excellent Podcast! Good questions posed too.

How did you entice the guests? How did you know about them, Grazor? Nice blend of coaches and players from SA, NSW and Q.

Have heard the name Peter Tsekinis quite a lot. Danny and Zac were good guests, providing a range of insights.

Was fascinated to hear Nick Carle is now Marconi Tech Dir. Wonder how many other former Socceroos are coaching at this level?
 
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I wonder how many G and G posters are listening to the Podcasts?

Or are a lot listening, but not commenting?

Perfect for an ironing or gardening session, or a longer car trip.
 
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