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FIFA WC 26 - Other Nations LIVE Match Thread ⚽

LFC said:
Yep they go to the extremes that challenge your feelings but you’re right it’s all out there but for the post actions that are very wrong.
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Yet when Redmayne throws a water bottle away he gets dragged down by his own as being no better than the South Americans.
 
tsf said:
Argentina are dirty fuckers.

But you know what, I'd have that in heartbeat,. They leave everything out there for their nation.

They're so unlikeable, I like them.
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I was utterly dismayed at Emiliano Martinez's behaviour in the Copa final against Colombia. With minutes to go and leading 1 0 he kept feining injury and doing everything possible to waste time and deny Colombia any chance of an equalizer. I was even more dismayed the ref allowed it all to unfold. I'm sure rule changes for this tournament were largely influenced by that display.

That all said, if he was doing it for Australia I'd be all for it. And yes, the bravado he showed was so ridiculous that deep down you just had to admire it.
 
A bit late to party but congrats to Spain, they fully deserved their win they were the protagonists and forced the game more whilst Argentina looked tired and relied on a odd error from Spain at the back or penalties to win it themselves.

But there was only 1 team that was going to win and it was Spain, 20 shots to 2 (it was actually 0 until the 118th minute!), if anything it was quite a one sided game compared to the closer games of 2022 and 2018 as well.

But Spain's way of playing is all down to big changes they made at grassroots level along with the influence of Johan Cruyff at the start of the 1990s and ever since then they have turned themselves as one if not the major powerhouse in world football, not bad for a country where they were seen as underachievers historically.

Also a shoutout to the coach in De La Fuente, he's done an unbelievable job he's not a big name but sometimes big name coaches come with egos and certainly this coach has showed he can put the team first for the greater good.

And just like that World Cup is over for another 4 years we are going to miss it but its back to club football again, as they say the show doesn't stop! :D
 
Also the conduct of the Argentina team towards the end was disappointing, they clearly are sore losers but come on show some respect and dignity after all these guys are professional players and not kids!

They were making fun of the French team in the Copa America success too, so they got form in both ends of winning and losing but it shows they don't conduct themselves well which looks poor on them given how much they done for football given the players and even coaches they have produced.
 
RoyalDave said:
I was utterly dismayed at Emiliano Martinez's behaviour in the Copa final against Colombia. With minutes to go and leading 1 0 he kept feining injury and doing everything possible to waste time and deny Colombia any chance of an equalizer. I was even more dismayed the ref allowed it all to unfold. I'm sure rule changes for this tournament were largely influenced by that display.

That all said, if he was doing it for Australia I'd be all for it. And yes, the bravado he showed was so ridiculous that deep down you just had to admire it.
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The way Australia slow down a game, even if they do, is nowhere near the blatant cheating other teams do. Officials need to clamp down on it. The injury and throw time rules were good.
 
Barca4life said:
Also the conduct of the Argentina team towards the end was disappointing, they clearly are sore losers but come on show some respect and dignity after all these guys are professional players and not kids!

They were making fun of the French team in the Copa America success too, so they got form in both ends of winning and losing but it shows they don't conduct themselves well which looks poor on them given how much they done for football given the players and even coaches they have produced.
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I can't wait for the English fans to go hard at every Argentina player in club football. Yeah, they're rich and don't care but let them have it!
 
LFC said:
one thing not mentioned much instead of Lamal etc is Rodri.
He was a puppet master today, sitting so high up the pitch due to dominating.
Also 1 player I really haven't rate a lot in the EPL, maybe never settled due to the club probs/coach changes many times is Cucurella.
Not just the final game but others I had watched him.
Yep he's signed for RM, maybe he's been released mentally for some of his Chelsea play wasn't great, well not to the WC form each game he's played.
Porro - another up and down player for Spurs.
Sure always been a fighter and a half but he also lifted this Cup.
That goal he scored the other game was first class.
His work rate, ball giving, always finding space.
I suppose when your in a team that has every position covered your confidence just oooze's.
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How I saw it as well, Porro & Cururella had great world cups, best fullbacks in the WC, didn't show this form in PL.
 
theFOOTBALLlover said:
I found it boring because it was one team playing and another team hoping (but not successfully) to hurt the opposition on the break. There have been more entertaining 0-0 games in this World Cup. My definition of entertaining might be different to yours.

Spain were good to watch but their front three weren't super effective. Congratulations to them. They deserved it this morning.
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Yep the non entertaining part was created by Argentina.

Some don't like the tika tak football of Spain, to me this is football.
 
I've had 24+ hours to digest and I can still only say that this was shameful. It hurts but in the end the better team won. Spain was very, very clearly the better team. The way Argentina played was just shameful. I'm ok with a level of shithousery, but this crossed a line and I feel it will do huge damage to Argentine football for a long time.

What I've been thinking about is, why did that happen?

Most modern Argentine coaches have been measured against either Bilardo (86 winner) or Menotti (78 winner). In retrospect Scaloni sits the in the Bilardo school in more ways than one. The first obvious one is the win at all costs brawler side (albeit I think the current behaviour would have made Bilardo blush). The second one was building a side around the 10, with most players chosen for their desire to run through walls to get the most out of him.

In contrast, I think you could say that a more Menotti approach was Bielsa's Argentina featuring Zanetti, Aimar, Mascherano, Batistuta. Or Pekerman's side with Sorin, Riquelme, Cambiasso, Crespo. Machines merging silk and steel with key players within the system, not dominating it.

That era was expressly built on reaching beyond Buenos Aires and into the provinces for talent, the character of players and the aesthetic of the football. Paradoxically, it won Argentina nothing. We made plenty of late tournament stages but always fell at the final hurdle.

From 2006 onwards we enter a mixed bag, an identity crisis and the Messi blessing/problem. I'll skip over that but the worst of it was under Maradona and Sampaoli. But it appeared in 2020 and then 2022, Scaloni had found the answer. Back to Bilardismo. And with it came a return to the darker arts.

Which brings us to this World Cup final. I think there were some serious game day tactical mistakes and a little bit of misfortune (maybe that's another post). But ultimately, I think hubris and the cult of Messi got a hold of this team and in particular Scaloni. Perhaps even Messi himself as this felt more and more like a vanity project as the tournament progressed. It was not about playing the right way and turning great performances into a shot at the title, it became a mission to get Messi another World Cup. The cost of that was that we saw the worst character of the likes of Perez, Montiel, Paredes and even Messi and we also saw diminished versions of players who should have been key contributors, not supporting actors - Alvarez, Martinez MacAllister. We saw next to nothing of some younger and emerging talent - Nico Paz, Almada and Barco.

We may not have won the final or even made it that far, but I don't believe we would have seen what we saw had the side been coached by someone more like Pekerman, Menotti or a Bielsa in his prime. Their approach embodies something I have always believed - winning has to be underpinned by a higher philosophy. In contrast what we saw from Argentina was pure nihilism. A debasement. Truly beautiful sides of the past, a record of producing near endless world class talent and the genius of Maradona, Riquelme, Messi, Di Maria etc are fading in the international memory, replaced with a near universal contempt for the Albiceleste.

I don't want that analysis to take away from Spain. They won and won well. It was not simply a case of Argentina capitulating.
 
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Robbos said:
How I saw it as well, Porro & Cururella had great world cups, best fullbacks in the WC, didn't show this form in PL.
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I think the tactical system implemented by Luis de la Fuente during the World Cup allowed Pedro Porro and Marc Cucurella to flourish and end up becoming the best fullbacks in the entire comp with Spain whereas they were being restricted under their respective head coaches at Spurs and Chelsea so they couldn't translate their international form to club level.
 
Punchanello said:
I've had 24+ hours to digest and I can still only say that this was shameful. It hurts but in the end the better team won. Spain was very, very clearly the better team. The way Argentina played was just shameful. I'm ok with a level of shithousery, but this crossed a line and I feel it will do huge damage to Argentine football for a long time.

What I've been thinking about is, why did that happen?

Most modern Argentine coaches have been measured against either Bilardo (86 winner) or Menotti (78 winner). In retrospect Scaloni sits the in the Bilardo school in more ways than one. The first obvious one is the win at all costs brawler side (albeit I think the current behaviour would have made Bilardo blush). The second one was building a side around the 10, with most players chosen for their desire to run through walls to get the most out of him.

In contrast, I think you could say that a more Menotti approach was Bielsa's Argentina featuring Zanetti, Aimar, Mascherano, Batistuta. Or Pekerman's side with Sorin, Riquelme, Cambiasso, Crespo. Machines merging silk and steel with key players within the system, not dominating it.

That era was expressly built on reaching beyond Buenos Aires and into the provinces for talent, the character of players and the aesthetic of the football. Paradoxically, it won Argentina nothing. We made plenty of late tournament stages but always fell at the final hurdle.

From 2006 onwards we enter a mixed bag, an identity crisis and the Messi blessing/problem. I'll skip over that but the worst of it was under Maradona and Sampaoli. But it appeared in 2020 and then 2022, Scaloni had found the answer. Back to Bilardismo. And with it came a return to the darker arts.

Which brings us to this World Cup final. I think there were some serious game day tactical mistakes and a little bit of misfortune (maybe that's another post). But ultimately, I think hubris and the cult of Messi got a hold of this team and in particular Scaloni. Perhaps even Messi himself as this felt more and more like a vanity project as the tournament progressed. It was not about playing the right way and turning great performances into a shot at the title, it became a mission to get Messi another World Cup. The cost of that was that we saw the worst character of the likes of Perez, Montiel, Paredes and even Messi and we also saw diminished versions of players who should have been key contributors, not supporting actors - Alvarez, Martinez MacAllister. We saw next to nothing of some younger and emerging talent - Nico Paz, Almada and Barco.

We may not have won the final or even made it that far, but I don't believe we would have seen what we saw had the side been coached by someone more like Pekerman, Menotti or a Bielsa in his prime. Their approach embodies something I have always believed - winning has to be underpinned by a higher philosophy. In contrast what we saw from Argentina was pure nihilism. A debasement. The memory of truly beautiful sides of the past, a record of producing near endless world class talent and the genius of Maradona, Riquelme, Messi, Di Maria etc fading, replaced with a near universal contempt for the Albiceleste.

I don't want that analysis to take away from Spain. They won and won well. It was not simply a case of Argentina capitulating.
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Very good post this.

From reading the papers in Argentina, I feel as though regardless of the result and the approach, there is a huge amount of love for the Selección because of Messi and what they did 4 years ago.

I don't think Argentina are ready for a reckoning until Messi retires and whatever the state of affairs may be at the next WC (presumably without him and many of the experienced over 30 players in the squad).

The identity crisis may still yet to come.
 
riquelmes_laces said:
Very good post this.

From reading the papers in Argentina, I feel as though regardless of the result and the approach, there is a huge amount of love for the Selección because of Messi and what they did 4 years ago.

I don't think Argentina are ready for a reckoning until Messi retires and whatever the state of affairs may be at the next WC (presumably without him and many of the experienced over 30 players in the squad).

The identity crisis may still yet to come.
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It's definitely coming. Messi has to retire at any minute. His ghost will haunt the shirt for a long time, for good and bad.

What I mean by contempt for the Albiceleste is from outside. The shirt will always be adored by Argentines, but they are also deeply sensitive to how they are perceived internationally. Fans I have spoken to have more or less said the same thing. We are used to losing right at the cusp, it happened for 32 years. But to watch us play like that for 90 minutes was excruciating.
 
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Punchanello said:
It's definitely coming. Messi has to retire at any minute. His ghost will haunt the shirt for a long time, for good and bad.

What I mean by contempt for the Albiceleste is from outside. The shirt will always be adored by Argentines, but they are also deeply sensitive to how they are perceived internationally. Fans I have spoken to have more or less said the same thing. We are used to losing right at the cusp, it happened for 32 years. But to watch us play like that for 90 minutes was a excrutiating.
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in the end Punch though that is your DNA.
If this sounds alright from my viewing all the years, always desperate to prove yourselves Internationally and especially in CON.
Brazil used to be the Kings - they belittled all - Uruguay have had their moments.
So being the conqueror is a huge badge as always.
Diego broke those losing shackles long ago even though he got away with the hand of god that was wrong.
Trauma is in the veins.
Messi has been the modern messiah - I'm sure there was desperation amongst the squad/Scaloni and supporters to send him off with the double but the trauma won this time.
You have gone through countless lows and rose again as you will And your right about the ghost.
Diego's was always hanging around # 10 and Messi has carried it immensely capping off Qatars win - I wonder IF your guys will retire it ??
For who can ever wear it as the next Messiah and pressure one wonders.
 
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